Stand Out and Score Gigs by Creating Unique Festival Experiences with Drew Dapps | EF EP 72

0:00 Although it's an upfront investment, the ability to exist in people's mind after the fact is priceless, you know, and people that would have never discovered my music or, or at least not in that way, now they're going home from the festival because they got my merch and they're streaming my Spotify and they're looking out for future merch drops and that type of stuff. What's up guys?

0:46 Happy Thursday. Today's episode guest is part of a full circle moment, as it often is because this industry is very small, as we all know. You first heard mention of my guest, Drew Dapps on Mikey Lyon's episode. Mikey was shouting out Camp Dappington, a very unique experience you're about to learn about and how showing up and offering value to events can put you in the front of the line for getting booked. That's what we were talking about with Mikey Lyon. Zooming out, what you're going to learn from today's episode is that you don't need to have a million followers to start creating offshoots of your brand. Things like activations, merch, you know, all those things that can bring you in money when your music alone is not yet. That's what we're talking about on today's episode with boutique house music artist Drew Dapps.

1:40 I'm super excited for you guys to learn something today. I'm super excited that we could finally chat. Yeah, for real. Thank you for having me on. I appreciate you. Big fan of the show. It's an honor. Thank you so much. I appreciate that. And I, you know, you were mentioned on this show before. You've been on the show yourself. Mikey Lyon brought you up, which I thought was very cool. Oh for real, that was a super touching shout out to Mikey. There's a there's an act named Drew Dapps, really awesome minimal tech producer, minimal house guy. I ended up having him play a set at Desert Hearts during the opening party just because. Like he fucking blew me away with his tenacity and.

2:23 Yeah, commitment. Yeah, that definitely made my day to hear that. Yeah, yeah. So I want to get into Camp Dappington, but I before that, let's back up. Talk to me about who you are. I saw in your marketing materials you call yourself a boutique house artist, So I'm very curious to know what that means. Hey. Yo, thank you for asking. So yeah, I feel like people put the term out there like underground, up and coming, and you know, I am those things, but at the same time, it's like not only am I up and coming, but my sound is rare.

3:04 And I feel like not only is the sound rare, but it's like suitable to be in a boutique shop, like at a fashion show. That minimal house sound is like a great for the shopping experience or like combined with the fashion context, you know what I'm saying? So rather than being just up and coming, I like to also be boutique and kind of be selective about where I'm doing shows, where I'm doing releases, kind of just elevate the brand in a special kind of way. You feel me? OK. So, so it was a branding decision which which I suspected, but I think that's really interesting that you've picked like fashion and like boutique stores as kind of part of your brand. And I know that you have merch to which we'll get into, but what I'm most interested in, you know, there's a lot of artists that listen to this show who feel like either they only want to work on music and nothing else, or they they feel stressed about having to do other things.

4:11 And you're in this whole other lane where you've got like festival experiences, you have merch. So can you tell me why you made that decision to spread yourself across a lot of creative mediums when most artists aren't doing that yet at at a similar stage? Yeah, for sure. That's another good question. So I mean, what's dope about the current state of the music industry is like it's never been more accessible to create music and get it out there, which is totally awesome. So for that reason, I feel like we're definitely in a creative renaissance and it's a good time to be an artist. But on the other side of the coin, it's like there's so many people out here cooking up music and DJ and doing that type of stuff.

5:01 So how can you diversify? Like how can you be different in a saturated market? And like you said, a lot of people are just so focused on the music, they think like they don't have time or it's not worth it to try other things. But on the real, if you'd doing other things, that's what's going to help you to stand out and get noticed in the market, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, yeah. And a lot of the artists that I bring on this show do have that one thing. I mean, gosh, father always comes to mind when we're talking about this because, you know, of the unique ways that he makes content and how he's like dominating threads. So.

5:43 So picking a lane and using it as like a a conductor or a platform to also uplift your music is a really smart marketing decision. And I always encourage the Patreon students. I have to make it something that already integrates with your daily life. Like so if you, you know, are a surfer, like find a way to incorporate surf and your music. If you, you know, if you like fashion, whatever it is, because that's going to make it less of an arduous lift, right? Because it's something you're already doing. Yeah, totally. And that's how I feel about skateboarding. Something that I grew up doing. Like literally one of my first memories ever is skating to my first day of school with my Big Brother. So it's like something that's always been a part of my life and I try to incorporate that into everything I do. Like for instance, you know how they're on Spotify, they got the the canvas videos that go along with the tracks. Or if you peep any of my songs on Spotify, it's all just skate clips from times I was skating at the skate park with the homies and actually kind of did 2 for one thing with that. Because when I drop music or a DJ mix, I like to also put out a skate video and that's like a unique way to do some marketing behind it.

7:07 And not only that, it's like affordable because going to the skate park is free and I'll just go skate with the homie. They'll get some clips for me. So not only will I roll out like a skate edit, meaning like a little montage with the music behind it, whether it be my track or some homies that I'm supporting in a DJ mix, but I'll also chop up those clips and have it be on my Spotify. So if you scrolling through any of my tunes, you'll see just clips of me skating. And that's not only a way to stand out, but it's just a way to be consistent with something too.

7:48 Yeah. So can you tell me? Because there's still a lot of people who don't, you know, they don't necessarily buy into like, you know, the power of this type of marketing and having a through line in your brand. Can you point to any ways that taking on this strategy has directly led to opportunities or successes for you? Yeah, for sure, for sure. So yeah, we we had talked a little bit about Camp Dappington in the beginning. So for the people that don't know, that's a theme camp that I set up a few years ago. The first time I ever did it was at the afternoon Umbrella Friends Umbrella weekend, which is a festival that goes down in Socal.

8:37 But they actually invited me to do a theme camp just because I had this thing going for my brand called Camp Dappington, which when I first started it up, it wasn't actually anything real. It was just something in my imagination just to exist as a piece of merch. Like I had some patches inspired by a Boy Scout patch, and I also had like some T-shirts. I say Camp Dappington. And since I had this imaginary thing going, they asked me, Drew, since you're going to be playing the festival anyways, would you be interested in setting up a camp diving to theme camp? And I'm like, yo, I have no idea what I'm going to do, but say less.

9:21 I'm about it. So I had this dilemma where I got to put on a theme camp, but I really don't know what the theme is going to be. And after giving it some thought for a while, like man, there's only one thing to do and that's to set up a Fingerboard skate park. Because along with growing up skateboarding, I grew up fingerboarding. And if you don't know about fingerboarding, it's like those little, little tech decks that used to be huge. Like in the early 2000s is like when it got a lot of attention. But the scene and fingerboarding is so huge today, if anything I say is growing, but I decide, you know, if I was at a festival, I would definitely be hyped if I saw that there was a Fingerboard skate park to shred.

10:05 So that's kind of what birthed the whole theme behind the theme camp. And well, like you said, it's definitely led to some opportunities. Like for instance, there is a festival that hit me up called Apple Cross and you know, they like my music and stuff, but where they really heard about me and why they wanted to book me. A big reason was because of the Camp Dockington theme camp. They saw how hard it went at another festival and how much people were enjoying themselves and how it was a highlight for a lot of the attendees at another festival. So that's why they wanted to book me. And I ended up being like pretty much the only house artist on the lineup. But since I really like the Fingerboard skate camp, they wanted to put me on, you know?

10:51 Oh my God. Well first I have to say I forgot that finger boarding existed until you and I connected. And then somehow yesterday, the universe put me in front of a German DJ from Berlin that was in Chicago for a fingerboarding conference. Yo, who? Who was that? His name, Hold on. I'm going to, I'm going to look at him right now because I was shooting some content with my business partner, Sherm, and we were like literally walking up and asking people if they were DJs and this guy happened to be 1. And then we're like, oh, what are you in town for? And he's like a fingerboarding content or a conference. His name is.

11:36 I think it's pronounced Heldo, but it's spelled Jaldo GJELDO. For sure, I'm definitely gonna have to tap in with him. Yeah, yeah, for real. So So that's really cool and I love what you just said there about being the only house artist at a non house festival, because I think I've been thinking about this from a fan perspective. I commented on this DJs video because he was like the only house artist at a bass festival and the stage was empty. I'm like, oh, is this the secret to have room to dance is go see the house artist at the bass shows, you know, and, and I think that there's like on the flip side for artists, there's a really good opportunity there. If you can find a unique way to brand yourself, your competition becomes a lot less.

12:26 I mean, there's just less of it if you're if you're going after different types of festivals. So is that like a lane that you've found yourself in more often? Yeah. I mean, I feel like there has been a lot of opportunities that have come up just by being different, whereas like my genre is almost not as relevant, you know? So I feel like staying true to who I am as a skater and as a fingerboarder has definitely led to a lot of opportunities where I might not have found myself there in other cases, you know, 'cause just putting out a lot of skate videos and doing that frequently has allowed me to connect with talent buyers that also like skateboarding.

13:15 So a lot of the times I'll go play a show in another city and me and the homie who booked me will be out skating at skate spots. It will just be like cruising the city getting skate clips. And if I had not been going hard on the skateboard stuff, then I don't know if he would have ever connected and got that show popping. And in turn, I don't know if I would have met these fans in another city and have made lasting connections with them. Yeah, that's another great point because I feel like, you know, this seen this industry is still not widely understood this type of music. Like if you say to someone who, you know, listens to Top 40 or rock, you'll be like, yeah, I like house music. They'll be like, oh, EDM, Martin Garrix, you know, you know, Diplo.

14:07 And so it's people. I feel like people go to like shows and festivals to find their tribe. It's just that we all understand. We all understand what we're here for. We understand this music, but it is a growing genre and it's interesting that you've been able to connect with people outside of the festival scene. That's kind of like proof positive that it's that you can do that. Yeah, totally, totally. I mean, I've had a lot of people come up to me at shows like, you know, I really mess with your brand because you out here like being a comedian, house DJ and like you're, you're not just making music, you're doing all types of different stuff that attract people to your brand.

14:51 Like whether it be the skating, just being a silly goose or going hard with the fashion line. You know, people that like clothing and style. I feel like I've been able to kind of invite them into my world who might have never tapped into house music and especially minimal house being more of a boutique niche kind of sound. Just doing this other stuff and building community around other clothing entrepreneurs, other skaters, and fingerboarders has definitely introduced people to a world that they may have never stepped in. Because with my shows that I put together, I'll bring a Fingerboard ramp and set it up at the merch booth.

15:34 Like whether it's just a small ramp or if it's a Camp Dappington function, I'll bring the whole skate park. But there's always going to be some element for people to engage with the fingerboarding. And I've for real pulled up to the local Fingerboard shop here in LA and I've just made friends there, like hit the Fingerboard park and let them know like, yo, I make music. I put on shows like and not only that, but we got the Fingerboard skate park. So pull up, come sesh and I'll get down to some house music if you bout it. And people that had would have never put on a minimal tech playlist ever in their life. Now they're getting put on to some grooves.

16:15 And I feel like minimal is a great introduction to the house rule because it's easy on the ears. You know, it's like, it's not offensive in any way. It's it's easy to get down to. So I really like being able to combine worlds and introduce people to what I'm doing through a unique way. Yeah, yeah, it's a great point. I think people are starting to, I'm noticing the trend in Chicago with amazing event producers that are popping up doing shows in unique spaces. Like there was, of course, just the house call show in a Portillo's with Chan Summit, but on a smaller scale, you know, house calls here's they're doing shows in helicopter pads and old warehouses, just cool locations still accessible from a from a price point perspective, pop ups in different restaurants, things like that.

17:10 And I think as the scene is evolving, people are starting to want more than just to, especially because I think sober culture is starting to get pushed a lot in this scene. And people who like this music are getting older and need something different. They can't go to a club until 2/3 in the morning, you know, every weekend. And so I think you raise a great point about introducing new folks to the scene and also giving existing fans a different opportunity to engage with the music outside of just going to a club, you know, until 2/3 in the morning. And I think, like, there are so many opportunities artists can take advantage of because of that fact.

17:56 And it doesn't need to cost a fortune. But that begs the question, you know, being an artist in 2024 is very expensive if you want to travel to gigs outside your hometown, which is a goal for many, marketing materials cost money unless you have the time to do it yourself. So can you walk me through like, what is what is an investment in creating an experience like this? And I guess maybe justify it to the people listening who are still skeptical. Yo, you make a great point there about the state of being an artist, how expensive it can be.

18:38 And yeah, it's definitely an investment if you want to do it right, whether with money and time or more realistically both. And yeah, like you're saying to do the Camp Dappington pop up at festival was definitely a big investment on both of those fronts. If a real took me like a month and I actually worked with my grandpa who's a Carpenter to help build this unique festival structure. And even though it took a really long time to learn those skills and it took money to get the lumber and get the decorations and the Fingerboard ramps and all that stuff.

19:24 At the end of the day, it was 1000% worth it because not only did it bring a joy to a lot of people, which is worth it on its own, but you know, now it's got people talking about my brand. And when I did the pop up, I had my merch there for people to check out. I was doing giveaways for the Fingerboard competition. So although it's an upfront investment, the ability to exist in people's mind after the fact is priceless. You know, and people that would have never discovered my music or, or at least. Not in that way. Now they're going home from the festival because they got my merch and they're streaming my Spotify and they're looking out for future merch drops and that type of stuff. So I definitely think that although it's hard to invest upfront, you just have to believe in your worth and realize that it's going to pay off down the line for sure. Yeah, yeah, that is such a great point. Brand awareness is a long game and we are so used to a online trying to chase viral moments and B, we have this backwards fucked up thinking that every dollar you invest, it has to lead to a ticket sale of this, that we assign a tangible to it. And it takes putting your brand in someone's mind multiple times for you to remember and then for

20:58 you to take an action. And so you know you're doing something that is you're building, you built a physical structure. It's hard to miss. And I think that that is so smart to have a like a tangible experience, like something where someone can come and, and, and physically do. And some of my friends who do similar things, I have a a girlfriend here who does something called deep house yoga. And you know, she DJs and she has a dance instructor and a yoga instructor and you know, it's a silent disco style, but it's like this tangible experience that she brings to festivals and her brand has blown up because of it. And what you're doing is so similar.

21:40 And I love what you said about, you know, the upfront investment being 1000% worth it because people, you know, not having the means as a separate conversation. But it's like, do you want to do this forever? Then you, you have to invest in your brand. Like if you want to make this a sustainable career, you have to invest. So I love everything you're doing. And you've mentioned merch a few times. I just had a conversation with a touring manager who said that his artist merch saved the tour from going into the red and we talked about how profitable it can be for an artist. So walk me through that decision to make merch and and how it benefits you.

22:21 Yeah, totally. So there's one book that I read which I recommend to any up and coming artist. It's called How to Make It in the New Music Business by Ari Herstand. And one of the things that really stood out to me was the fact that he said if you make merch, then you can turn your shows from going from breaking even if you're lucky to being profitable, like you said. So that definitely stuck out to me. And just growing up, always been a fashion dude, you know what I'm saying? Like I was the vice president of fashion club in school. So that's always been a big part of my identity. So doing merch was just something that came natural to me.

23:08 And I started doing merch like probably sooner than I should have or sooner than most people would have. But since style and clothing is such a big part of my identity, that's something I wanted to do as soon as I dropped my first EPI wanted to have merch. And you know, it's kind of scary to invest in making clothing, especially when you have physical product. Like sitting underneath your bed is a little bit of a stressor. You know, it's like, how am I going to move this merch? But at the same time, I feel like that's putting a fire under your ass to really make something happen with that merch.

23:51 And just setting up a booth that shows like, bro, there's so many times when I play the venue and the talent buyer has told me, like, yo Drew, you're actually the first artist that's ever played here to set up a merch booth. And I'm like, bro, that's crazy to me because setting up the merch booth is like what saves the tour. Like you said, that's what makes the the trip profitable and allows me to keep going and doing these shows. And it's just like a big missed opportunity for a lot of artists, I feel like. Because not only are you making some more bread, but the fans are going home with the souvenir, They're going home with something tangible.

24:34 And now if they're rocking their merch, that's like advertisement for your brand, for your, for your music. And the more that you can make something that's actually stylish and people want to wear and put together a crispy fit with, then the more that you're going to exist in their mind and the more that they're going to put other people onto your brand. It's so true, I didn't even realize I'm wearing an artist's merch right now that I bought and look at how cool this shirt is. There we go. Yeah, that, that shit crispy. And that's why you're wearing it. Like you got to put some thought into what your pieces look like. And the more crispy it is, the more often people are going to wear it. It's it's so true.

25:17 And I mean, I've seen a lot of bad merch, right? There's a lot of lazy merch out there and it's, you know, either from the fact that the shirt is not comfortable or they got the most basic. I do think I'm, I'm of the camp that if you're going to make merch, like make it either high quality in design or in fabric or both, if you can, you know, make it comfortable. One thing I have to say, and I don't know where you fall on this. I struggle to find women's merch at shows and that is something, I don't know how you feel about that, but like they're so like I have so many boxy T-shirts that I end up just wearing to sleep in because they only sell, you know, men's or unisex size clothing. Where do you fall on that?

26:13 Yo, that's a good question. So I feel like a big inspiration to my brand is Drew House, and not just because it got Drew in the title, but I love what they're doing as far as making pieces that's available for everyone to wear, whether you're a boy or a girl or whatever is fresh and it fits the body in a way that can be rock with a variety of fits. So when I'm making a merch, I try to make it a unisex appeal for everybody. And you make a good point though, because it is a little more expensive to make men's and women's cuts. But I just feel like if you can make something that's fresh for everybody and it complements the body, feels good on your skin, then I think that's the best way to do it if you can. Yeah, I agree.

27:15 And, and you said that you started making merch probably earlier than you should have. Do you think it is a good idea for other artists to, to start dabbling? I mean, you said that you have, you know, stock sitting under your bed, but it's not like that stock. Like, it's not like there's a shelf life on it, right? Yeah, totally. And there's a lot of heads out there that will recommend you to do print on demand, but personally I don't think that's a good route because if someone is copping your merch online, then you don't have a chance to put that personal touch on it. You know what I'm saying? Like if you shopping with dabs apparel, I try to make sure that when you get that pack, it feels like Christmas Day for real.

28:01 When you open it up, it's the whole last experience and it's like something that's fun, something that's going to want to people to the shop again, you know, And I really don't think there's ever too early to start if what you have is a quality fresh ass offering, you know, and like we're saying about the unisex appeal, one way that you can do that is by making accessories like whether it be hats or jewelry, something crazy, you know, just think outside of the box and think of what would you want to wear, like what what would be fresh for your outfits, you know, and I think that's how you can really go hard on the whole merch offerings if you just think of something that you want to wear and just go in on it.

28:56 Yeah, yeah, I, I think it's a great idea. I mean, if you want to make music, you know, sustainable and support you full time, you, you definitely have to diversify and it's not easy. It's a long game, but it's worth it. And so I think that you're a great case study and showing that, you know, you don't have to have 1,000,000 followers to do these sorts of experiences, make these sort of items, you know, people, people will still buy and invest because you're providing them so much value down to the packaging that you put the shirts in. So what would be your advice for artists listening to this show, if they are, you know, looking ahead to 2025, how should they be moving differently based on what you've learned from from trying all these things? Yeah, for sure.

29:53 Good question. So I just say look at yourself and just think like, what makes you different? What's something that you do that nobody else does? What do you do better than everyone else? And just don't be shy about it. You know, I feel like a lot of people, they don't want to expose like their personal interests or they might be embarrassed about it. Like, you know, when I first started off, like I was really low key about the fingerboarding because I didn't want people to make fun of me or whatever. But on the real like staying true to who I am is that's what's really helped me to elevate my brand. So just ask yourself what makes you different and how can you incorporate that into the music?

30:41 You know, like you said, maybe you like surfing, why don't you throw some surfing clips on your Spotify canvases or whatever you like? Just incorporate that into your branding and reach out to other people in that community outside of music and introduce them to your stuff and just build connections that way. Because there's probably a lot of people out there that would be into your music, but they didn't really have a chance to discover you yet. But if you make those connections and just be your unique, authentic self, then that's when the real magic happens. You got to step out of your comfort zone because so that's when you start making moves for real, for real. I love it, I love it.

31:28 So tell me what you have coming up. Is there any Camp Dappington experiences on the horizon? I know we're heading into winter as I'm looking out. It's like 40° outside in Chicago right now, but what do you have coming up? Yeah, for sure. Thank you for asking. So although Camp Dappington started off as a theme camp at festivals, I'm definitely looking into doing more independent events. Just recently we had our first independent show here in LA where we booked a venue called Scribble and we brought out the Fingerboard skate park. I booked one of my favorite artists, Groove, all brought a special guest onto the lineup as well. So not only just doing theme camps, but definitely looking to do full blown the concerts as well. And also just doing like special pop ups where people get a chance to shred the Fingerboard skate park, shop the dots apparel, clothing line.

32:27 But we're also going to be slapping some minimal deep tech slappers you already know. So I'm definitely looking to expand the the operation beyond just theme camps, but doing our our own independent concerts and events as well. So just trying to bring the the good vibes to more cities and just trying to spread the love as much as I can. I love it. This has been really insightful and I think it'll inspire other artists to, you know, really lean into what makes them unique. It's it's great advice. It's like always the most basic, simple things that make the most sense and work, you know, you don't need to reinvent the wheel.

33:11 Just be yourself. So. That's real. Thank thank you for this. It was so great to finally connect and I hope I I used to. I had a few tech decks in 6th and 7th grade because I my first boyfriend was a skater. So I'll, I'll have to, I'll have to see if my brother has one that I can dabble with again and hopefully try out Camp Camp Dappington one day. Yeah, that's what's up. I hope to see you out there. I want to see you in the competition for real. OK, I'm going to have to start practicing now. Get those picks so much. Thank you for having me. It's been real. This is a lot of fun.

33:53 I hope this episode inspires you to not keep the parts of what makes you you separate. Just like Drew skateboarding, if you have something that's so integrated with your life you can't imagine life without it, well then that's a good use case for it to be part of your brand. And this is a perfect segue to tease what's happening next week on the pod. I am bringing on my good friend and former Elevated Frequencies social Media manager Sabrina Diamond to talk about content pillars. Sabrina has worked with VH1 BET. She's been in the music industry for a long time. And if you have no idea about what to post on social media beyond sharing your gigs or track releases, and if you need help getting organized on social media, then this is the episode for you, no doubt. And of course, I can't end today's episode without reminding you about Chicago Music Nexus because we are literally less than a month away and I am busier than ever getting this event together.

34:51 Guys, so many cool things are happening. We're going to have so many fun surprises and activations for you. I can't wait for this to happen. I can't believe it's coming to fruition. I would love to see you all there. I know for a fact I have three of my Patreon students flying in for this. It means the world to me. The Code Podcast gets you $30 off your pass at Chicago Music nexus.com. I can't wait to see you guys there. I'll talk to you next week. Stay elevated.